Dvader said:

I said the penalty this guy is getting is crazy, obviously its almost joke like just to get a point across. He should be punished reasonably.

And that's what I'm getting at.  None of this "making a statement" crap, you're making a statement with a man's life.  Not only that, it affects everyone who follows him.  In terms of Sony, my point on that was that the only difference there is the ease in which you can exploit it.  I think it's unlikely that there's no provision in the EULA about sharing account information, and it's not as if it hasn't been enforced.  Remember, it's not about how many people download it, it's that it was made available, at least in terms of our discussion.  And no, I don't think you should be liable at all but that's a separate issue.

Archangel3371 said: 

This isn't game sharing though. He actively circumvented a copyright protection.

 You actively circumvent copyright protection if you rip a CD to listen on your computer or MP3 player.  As a Linux user, I have to do that in order to watch a DVD -- which I own -- on my computer.

Yodariquo said:

Dvader said:

I said the penalty this guy is getting is crazy, obviously its almost joke like just to get a point across. He should be punished reasonably.

And that's what I'm getting at.  None of this "making a statement" crap, you're making a statement with a man's life.  Not only that, it affects everyone who follows him.  In terms of Sony, my point on that was that the only difference there is the ease in which you can exploit it.  I think it's unlikely that there's no provision in the EULA about sharing account information, and it's not as if it hasn't been enforced.  Remember, it's not about how many people download it, it's that it was made available, at least in terms of our discussion.  And no, I don't think you should be liable at all but that's a separate issue.

Archangel3371 said: 

This isn't game sharing though. He actively circumvented a copyright protection.

 You actively circumvent copyright protection if you rip a CD to listen on your computer or MP3 player.  As a Linux user, I have to do that in order to watch a DVD -- which I own -- on my computer.

Dvader said:

I don't understand what you want to do, just allow ripped games to be all over the web. Not even try to stop it. Can you stop it, probably not, but they have a right to try and they should. If this man decided to rip the game and make it available for all for shits and giggles, then he should be punished. Not in the your life is over way but some type of fine, some type of legal charge. Something that will show up in his record. Something that will make him and others to think twice before doing something like that.

 In this case, in principle, that I would agree with.  My problem then becomes, though, the distinction between distribution and download, and the ability to show evidence beyond a reasonable doubt.  With the fundamental way the Internet works, it is incredibly difficult to show that an individual is culpable, and it's absolutely crucial that that is understood and this is all approached with that in mind.  If there is prosecution, there by necessity has to only be that of the uploader, not downloader (it is in this case)

However, one issue I have is that the laws are there to reflect society's values, and the constitution and/or bill of rights (in the US, the latter's included in the former), provides for rights to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority.  It's is evident by the propagation of such media sharing that society's values, for better or worse, admittedly or not, are distancing from the ever-increasingly restrictive copyrights that have been progressing over the past century. 

Archangel3371 said:

 Unless I'm mistaken there's no code that you have to hack or crack to rip a music cd. Ripping a music cd or a movie dvd to watch on your computer is very different then hacking the copyright protection and distributing the product freely over the internet.

 Actually, no, you're using the term "hacking" but there's no difference.  DVDs use CSS encryption, while audio CDs vary.  I use libcss, which breaks the encryption, in order to watch them on my computer.  The only distinction you could make is that somebody else wrote libcss and libdvdread.  You explicitly made a point to say "He actively circumvented copyright" to suggest that his working around the disk encryption made it worse.  I am stating that this is part of the problem in the first place.  It's something paying customers illegally (in the US) work around to use the product the way they want.  You wanted stricter copyright law?  Welcome to the DMCA.  You know what else comes with the DMCA?  If someone files a DMCA complaint, American companies are forced to pull the content unless a counter-claim is made.  That is to say, if you post a video on Youtube, anyone from anywhere can make a frivilous copyright claim and Youtube is legally required to take down your video.  This is what "making a statement" gets you.

Yodariquo said:

Archangel3371 said:

 Unless I'm mistaken there's no code that you have to hack or crack to rip a music cd. Ripping a music cd or a movie dvd to watch on your computer is very different then hacking the copyright protection and distributing the product freely over the internet.

 Actually, no, you're using the term "hacking" but there's no difference.  DVDs use CSS encryption, while audio CDs vary.  I use libcss, which breaks the encryption, in order to watch them on my computer.  The only distinction you could make is that somebody else wrote libcss and libdvdread.  You explicitly made a point to say "He actively circumvented copyright" to suggest that his working around the disk encryption made it worse.  I am stating that this is part of the problem in the first place.  It's something paying customers illegally (in the US) work around to use the product the way they want.  You wanted stricter copyright law?  Welcome to the DMCA.  You know what else comes with the DMCA?  If someone files a DMCA complaint, American companies are forced to pull the content unless a counter-claim is made.  That is to say, if you post a video on Youtube, anyone from anywhere can make a frivilous copyright claim and Youtube is legally required to take down your video.  This is what "making a statement" gets you.

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Yodariquo said:

Bizarre discovery: GameSpy's favicon address redirects to IGN's:

http://gamespy.com/favicon.ico

Hmmmmm, Interesting....