Forum > Gaming Discussion > God of War is stealing my time.
God of War is stealing my time.
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Mon, 21 May 2018 01:37:20
+1
Dvader said:
But you don't care about any of that, cause you seem completely incapable of seeing anything past your prism of critique. It seems like anyone who likes anything you don't is just a fool who doesn't have standards, anyone who doesn't like something you do doesn't have the expertise you do.

Sunshine have you read any of your inane ass posts? lol If anyone dares to disagree with one of your sacred children you have to find every sort of way to down play their opinion, as opposed to actually getting the fuck over it. Pot meet kettle.


I wrote a sentence sport, a sentence. Calling the game shallow, which it is if you actually play action games.

Dvader said:
  I don't know what you are doing with this enemy list thing, as I showed basically every enemy type in GoW3 has some kind of equivalent in GoW4. If there are fewer enemy types it's by so few that it doesn't matter and the enemy type so in gow4 are more interesting to fight. Souls and Nioh are absurd with the amount of enemies they have (though Nioh gets really repetitive, with its standard types). DMC never had that many enemies, neither doesn't bayo. The standard action game has around 30 types, GoW is right around there.

Bayonetta has 40, Bayonetta 2 has more than that. Ninja Gaiden has 48 before boss fights get included. God of War 4 flat out has less enemies, this isn't hard to get at. Given you like to fucking review your games on decimals, I'd say giving up 10 or more enemies is fairly signifcant. Especially for a sequel. Freakin Onimusha has like 30 not counting its bosses. Slice it anyway you like God of War does less than the top tier in the genre, and for a game that's supposed to be excellent, at best, it's been on par with the action games below the top tier.  

Dvader said:

Your example of navigating combat to raise your magic bar is a poor one. There are only a handful of fights in GoW3 with sirens or special enemies who actually give you magic when you brutal kill them. Few fights have chests around to refill. The grand majority of time the fight has no way to refill any magic. Contrast that to four slots with about 20 different moves to choose from, all with different levels of cooldown some as short as 15 seconds. Moves that give all kinds of attacks, some ranged, some buffs, some heal, some are AoE, some stun and each can be customized even further with level gains. Screw that a stupid magic button that lets out some crappy AoE attack every time you so happen to have energy is better than managing a bunch of moves. Not to mention how much better rage mode is in this game with its own set of attacks.

Except any larger set of enemy was going to give you some magic, hell the little goons give you some magic, albeit less frequently. Cool downs only have one general short coming: opportunity cost. The only decision there is use now, or use later. Which is mitigated by the time frame. A resource has added functions beyond opportunity cost, how much you're gonna use, can you quickly refill it, etc. And God of War's crowd control stuff was covered by its its dial combos, making magic just another quick DPS down you could put down. But sure Rage mode in 4 adds more moves to God of War 4, it does that one thing better. Neat. Most of your cool down moves on top of being cool downs, work very much in the way other games built around cool downs work. They are more abilities than they are interesting commands. Commands stuff like startup, active frames, recovery frames actually plays a role.


Cool downs your left with a quick popping ability that does its thing, with no little to no impunity and you go at it. move on to your next cool down move you are going to use, while you wait for the other one to cycle back down. Creating a late game where you are just running a rotation of abilities for the most efficient play.


And all of this ignores God of War isn't the only one to have a magic bar. Bayonetta also has one, Onimusha would be another example of expelling a resource, The Wonderful 101's batteries are effectively a magic meter.

Dvader said:

You can say the DMC and Souls/Nioh type games are deeper than this but to say the old GoW games had better combat is ridiculous.

You say this, but again one is more expressive than the other, one has less redundant options than the other, one has a larger enemy pool to work with, one plays faster than the other, and the other one gets oh right a bunch of rpg elements tacked on to an action game. Which while we're on the subject did you know that in Nioh n Souls games a low level run is actually viable, since those games actually reward a players skills at the game? God of War 4, in its infinite wisdom, does the usual western rpg move of making the player level an end all be all stat, regardless of where you pump your other stats with your gear. Because if you're about 3 levels too low of some enemies in God of War 4, it'll put the Warcraft/Witcher 3 red skull on enemies to get the point across that you can't do shit to the enemies.

Fuck me, that's what action games needed. Stats.

Dvader said:

The only reason GoW games are as good and better than many action games is cause it is half action adventure game.

They were never as good as the better action games. But at least the older God of War the platforming was like actual platforming and at least the puzzles while being limp, were at least sort of a puzzle. The new game has regressed even further in both, and those were the shallowest elements of a God of War game.

Dvader said:
Shit on the story and adventure elements all you want, doesn't change the fact that those additions make this a more interesting game than Nioh, than Bayonetta, than many of this just action games.

You should learn what a fact is. Because it's not a fact. You yourself find it more interesting, that could be a fact. But it doesn't inherently make the game more interesting. Those elements are vapid stretches of the game. You as a player are barely even tested or kept honest. Nioh n Bayonetta offer a lot more for the players investment and skill.

Dvader said:
GoW offers so much more than most action games while having a combat system that feels unique. But you don't care about any of that, cause you seem completely incapable of seeing anything past your prism of critique.

It's called having a criteria slick, it's pretty simple. If a game is going to make me do a thing, I expect said thing to be engaging and enjoyable. And I am engaged and enjoying a game when that comes down to its interactions. How satisfying they are to do, how much depth the gameplay loop has, and how the game extrapolates that depth from the systems. I do not value a game that tries a bunch of things, I'm not a fucking charity, I don't care that you tried. Actually execute. If you're going to make the deepest part of your gameplay loop combat, the combat should be better than okay for what is supposed to be a would be classic. More to it if a significant amount of time is spent on traversal segments or puzzle solving, both of those should be good. Not okay. Not "fine". Genuinely, good.

And in the case of Dad of War, they are nothing more than a bare bones "pacing" mechanism that frankly wastes my time.


I could get over what God of War does poorly, if the things it did "well" were actually better, as it stands they are par at best. I at the least got a chuckle out of "unique", lol. Yeah man a derivative mish mash of so many played out gamedesign tropes of the last decade is unique.

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Mon, 21 May 2018 07:43:02
+3
Dvader said:

Or maybe you taste is just different cause as you said you rather have the one trick pony, I rather have the game that tries a lot more. And that's ok, there doesn't have to be a right or wrong with what kind of game you like more.



Gagan said:

What Gagan said.



Gagan saw the peace pedgeon offered to him by Vader, acknowledged it, trampled it, plucked it, and had it for dinner. After that he proceeded to burn the remaining bones and fat and made a soap out of the residu, with which to scrub his nether regions.
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Mon, 21 May 2018 08:47:24

LOL

Well, he didn't start with one.

All this just makes me slightly more curious about it than I was before, when all it had going for it was (very likely) unintentional humour; now it offers me the chance to join in one of history's greatest debates.

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The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst  
Are full of passionate intensity.
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Mon, 21 May 2018 14:41:11

It's the most condescending attempt at a peace offering. lol.

Get your butthole puckered over 28 words, a 10/10, and a hashtag, and then after all that try the enlightened approach. Lets pimp out the "there is no right or wrong way to like a thing" without once applying that logic to the inverse, that there is no right or wrong way to dislike a thing. And fuck that Tomas, 2018, learn fighting games. Your gaming diet has a ridiculous proportion of point n click garbage, and no where near enough fighting games.

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Mon, 21 May 2018 20:58:33
+2

If someone has a differences of opinion than me I will start a debate with them but won't be condescending, won't call everything I don't like total shit. You just seem to hate everything, everyone on this site sees it, here comes the guy shitting on everything. No fun allowed.

I acknowledging you are making fine points, for one I never once said GoW is top tier, it seems exactly why I told you to name me games not in the DMC/Bayo/NG class cause it's NOT top tier. I believe it is next tier, I will debate anyone who thinks old GoW has better combat. Yes I much rather have a rotation of abilities, abilities I can customize for my current fight. Instead of just using the on era strategy old GoW games give you, going after the magic givers to recharge, I can come up with a bunch of different strategies. That said just the abilities, ranged attacks are vastly inproved in this game. Move sets are deeper, the ability to freeze enemies out of a fight makes it deeper. The ability to use your environment in ways to get a quick instant kill is deeper. And I still think you are bullshitting this enemy count, counting every single enemy type in those other games and only sticking to major types in this one, there are like six different eyeball enemies alone. If I'm wrong I'm wrong, just shows how great these enemies are that I didn't feel fatigue with the regular grunts like I did in other action games like Nioh.

We simply don't agree on action adventure games then, can't do much about that. As I said give me the game that tries to do a lot, surprise me. I still love my one trick ponys as well, but I am a fan of action adventure games first than a guy hung up on just the combat system.

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Mon, 21 May 2018 22:49:20
+1

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Mon, 21 May 2018 22:50:23
Gagan said:

It's the most condescending attempt at a peace offering. lol.

Get your butthole puckered over 28 words, a 10/10, and a hashtag, and then after all that try the enlightened approach. Lets pimp out the "there is no right or wrong way to like a thing" without once applying that logic to the inverse, that there is no right or wrong way to dislike a thing. And fuck that Tomas, 2018, learn fighting games. Your gaming diet has a ridiculous proportion of point n click garbage, and no where near enough fighting games.

Don't worry, I certainly won't be playing God of War (any time soon, anyway).

For awhile, however, you've been playing more point and clicks than I have, and shitter ones than I'd ever go near.

Dvader said:

Good god you are an awful judge of games.

IMHO that isn't starting a debate and if it's not condescending, it's certainly not accounting for differences in taste.

I don't mind heated arguments in the least, so don't take that as a criticism; I'm also not suggesting Gagan didn't return fire in kind.

Edited: Mon, 21 May 2018 23:05:24
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere  
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst  
Are full of passionate intensity.
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Tue, 22 May 2018 03:04:11
+1
Dvader said:

If someone has a differences of opinion than me I will start a debate with them but won't be condescending, won't call everything I don't like total shit.

Again. Read. Your. Own. Post lol.

Dvader said:

You just seem to hate everything, everyone on this site sees it, here comes the guy shitting on everything. No fun allowed.

Out of the 25 games I beat last year, since we have a games beaten thread. 13 of them I had a positive reaction to as far as how I judge games.


The year before that when I beat like 72 games. I was positive towards 38 of those games, and more often than not I give the games I beat a pretty extensive impression of why I felt a certain way. So at best I split down the middle as opposed to hating everything, and that's because yeah I'm far more critical of what I play. I lean towards the notion that anyone who is an enthusiast of an art form, a patron of an art form, only benefits from being a bit more critical/analytical of what they consume. And in this mediums case I lean towards the gameplay, it's not being hung up on "just the combat", it's being hung up on the gameplay. The single most important part of the medium. And I judge it on its depth, because there is an obvious logic n correlation between good gameplay n depth.

Either way I'm not going to sugar coat anything. Nor am I going to just be sunshine positive to the greatest hits of metacritic because they are pretty n they try. Especially when these things are presented as industry moving events, and in more ways than one they are a sign of regression in game design.

Dvader said:

I acknowledging you are making fine points, for one I never once said GoW is top tier, it seems exactly why I told you to name me games not in the DMC/Bayo/NG class cause it's NOT top tier.

And I've been saying that the tier below those games, still has games with more depth than any God of War game, especially the new one.

Dvader said:

And I still think you are bullshitting this enemy count,m.

Nope, that one is pretty cut n dry. I went to the wikis for these respective games. Raw quantity of enemies and took my own opinion out of the equation. Here are how many different enemy types this game has, and here are the different enemy types this game has. Accounting for even when you have 3 sub classes of the same type of enemy.

Otherwise I don't care enough to fight it out over the cool downs vs resource. I would rather have a resource, because moves made for a resource actually function like moves. Where as a cool down is treated with a quick ability design, with no real down side sans opportunity cost. I would rather have the more expressive options I had in the older God of War games, because I flat out could do more. It had more of an air game, I could crowd control more consistently in a move chain, and the spells had more variable uses in combo strings at different parts of a combo string. The new left me with the most basic launcher juggle combo possible, and a bunch of cool downs that feel far more rigid.

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Sat, 26 May 2018 21:29:03
+1

I have called you foolz an awful judge of games before, same with Iga and others. In turn you have shot it back at me. Difference is you guys can be playful, I guess gagan is not.

Gameplay is much more than just how deep the combat is. You are going to sit there and tell me zelda games are awful cause combat isnt deep. Gameplay is everything, how a game controls, the level design, the enemy encounters, the variety in situations, puzzles, abilities, all of it. One game has room after room of just combat and another has rooms of combat mixed with puzzles and exploration, I'm going to usually take the one that does different things as long as its of great quality, which God of War is.

And seriously you are about the only person I have ever seen have the opinion that old GoW games have better combat. Everyone here that played this, do any of you think old games had better combat than this game?

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Sun, 27 May 2018 08:25:38

I remember you calling me that a few times, but not what I said (if I said anything) in reply, so it can't have been very memorable and you therefore beat me. Sad

(Although I was definitely right about whatever game we were discussing.) Nyaa

The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere  
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst  
Are full of passionate intensity.
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Sun, 27 May 2018 13:34:23
+1

I don't feel like the combat is better or worse than the old games, just different. I do prefer the new style though because to me it feels more visceral and in your face.

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Sun, 27 May 2018 15:50:32
+1
edgecrusher said:

I don't feel like the combat is better or worse than the old games, just different. I do prefer the new style though because to me it feels more visceral and in your face.

I think I agree.  I’ve had very little time with the game but do enjoy the varied encounters so far.  

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