We seemed to have more 60fps games last gen than this gen, it's like they're taking steps backward. Oh well, I imagine that next gen they'll all do mostly 60 fps. They should have more power than they even need then, being able to achieve Crysis level visuals and beyond even with sloppy programming by comparison, being more restricted by their own skill and budget than the power of the systems they program for. Even if next gen takes a while.
I first noticed the difference before I got a PC when I saw the Dreamcast running Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver side by side with a PlayStation (1). Their visuals were almost identical (sharper and stuff on DC, obviously) as the game was merely a port rather than something made exclusively for the Dreamcast but the 60 fps made it look so much better. It's really a shame not all developers strive for that, I think the 60 fps enhance the visual quality much more than a few extra post processing and other intensive effects that require dropping back to 30. I also think it's mostly Western developers' fault, Eastern still seem to try for 60 more often than not.
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Agnates said:It's weird how the Wii almost seems to have more 60fps games than the PS360.
This is true.
Nintendo games that run 60fps
Galaxy 1 and 2
NSMBWii
Mario Kart Wii
Wii Sports and Wii Sports Resort
Metroid Prime Trilogy
Sin and Punishment 2
Super Smash Brawl
Excite Truck and Bots (I think)
Yeah it is important especially for action packed games or games that use the pointer. It controls smoother, and therefore it plays better. I consider framerate to be directly tied to gameplay. Shitty framerate makes for shittier gameplay.
Ravenprose said:I have a real hard time telling the difference between them. Personally, I'd rather have a rock solid 30 fps with more graphics/larger enviroments, than 60 fps with less.
I wonder if I'd be able to tell the difference in a blind test. Does running at 60 fps make it so that when there is a whole lot of stuff going on in a game it won't appear to slow down? (I know nothing about this kind of thing).
The only exception to this would be fighting games. Then it can become impossible.
aspro said:Ravenprose said:I have a real hard time telling the difference between them. Personally, I'd rather have a rock solid 30 fps with more graphics/larger enviroments, than 60 fps with less.I wonder if I'd be able to tell the difference in a blind test. Does running at 60 fps make it so that when there is a whole lot of stuff going on in a game it won't appear to slow down? (I know nothing about this kind of thing).
It makes motion appear smoother and more natural to the eye at all times, not just in certain parts. Imo, it greatly enhances the look of a game. What you describe is different. If you notice slow-downs mid game then it likely gets below the game's average frame rate, making the difference obvious. If the game's mostly 30 fps and it dips down to 20 in the heat of the action you will notice, the same if it's normally 60 and it dips to 30.
Here's an extremely rough 30 to 60 fps comparison for you.
Watch this (or any other) Red Steel 2 video. The game normally runs in 60 fps but flash videos like YouTube, GameTrailers, etc, half the frame rate and don't display all of the frames in order to reduce the file size.
Now also watch any of the streams on this page (scroll down a little). Gamersyde streams are in full 60 fps. Since Red Steel 2 also runs in 60 fps you can see its full range of frames in this stream. Ignore any image quality differences (since the Gamersyde stream is off-screen, not direct feed) or the fact it's different areas.
If it's too heavy for your internet connection then try clicking play, and as soon as it actually starts showing anything pause it for a few minutes until it loads a sizable portion of the video, so that you can watch it all in sequence.
Games basically update the image 30 or 60 times per second as is already implied. It's natural that the more updates of the image you have, the smoother the motion, animations, and everything will appear. The fewer frames you have, then the choppier movement is, as it has larger gaps between updates, so you miss parts of the arc of any movement, whether that's the camera movement or a character's animation.
It might seem faster but it's not, if we had a side by side comparison of 30 to 60 fps the videos would have the exact same length, one is simply much more fluid and therefor more natural.
You might not be able to tell when something is 30 or 60 on its own but you'd certainly notice a pleasant difference on 60. Otherwise you may not be able to say exactly what seems off. On PC if you have Half-Life, Counter-Strike and the like there are command lines to force the frame rate, you can force it to 30, play for 5 minutes, then force it to 60 and see the difference in smoothness both in appearance and in the behaviour of your mouse controls (less frame rate means your cursor is less accurate as it jumps between points instead of move smoothly).
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The optimist proclaims we live in the best of all possible worlds while the pessimist fears this is true. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
Before this gen started I thought YES, finally with this power, all games will be polished and run at 60 FPS.
How wrong I was. Its the nature of developers to push systems for detail at the expense of frame rate, like many Xbox shooters like Chronicles of Riddick or Halo 2.
I would rather have a solid visual style running at 60 like Timesplitters or Black or something. Was Black 60?
Agnates, thanks for that explanation. I was not able to watch the videos though (internet).
Listen to Iced Earth and play Doom
But I know that Modern Warfare 2 is 60fps and playing that again after playing Battlefield Bad Company 2, I have to admit I notice a significant difference. It really is smoother, easier to shoot, maybe too smooth because I was having trouble aiming after getting used to BFBC2.
I will say this, although I like Bad Company 2's multiplayer experience more, the only thing I give more props to MW2 is the 60fps thing. It really is a amazing technical achievement. Granted the MW2 maps are much smaller and the Bad Company 2 maps are gigantic with incredible draw distance, but it's enough to wish that Bad Company 2 was also 60fps.
Anyway, what about you guys? What do you guys think of this?
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Now Playing: Golden Sun Dark Dawn, God of War Ghost of Sparta, and DKC Returns