I'm another one of those guys who definitely does not want to go back to 8-bit graphics for anything. It lacks so much detail and looks, well, pixelated. Any strictly 2D games should be post-16-bit, so to speak, to appeal to me... unless it's like the 2D Metroids or Zeldas.
Yeah I agree.
Its just like with 3D.....why would I want someone to make a new AAA game with PS1-level graphics, instead of something at least around Dreamcast-level, with some actual detail and visually detectable emotion?
I view this whole 2d thing the same way. Its awesome making 2d games, but why revert to way outdated graphics to do it when you could do it with a bit more flash?
MegaMan 9 looks absolutely JAW DROPPING. Look at the level of detail in his expressions as he unwillingly has to kill to survive. You can see that Mega really regrets what he's doing, but has no choice.
It's becoming very evident that this game is being designed and animated by an animation company. Wario's animation's and sprite look stellar. Though it will be quite sometime until systems can handle such animation under non-context real-time settings with such highly imported quality files (the PS3 and 360 can't even do it).
So...who here thinks that this game has a chance of selling?
angry_beaver said:
I'm another one of those guys who definitely does not want to go back to 8-bit graphics for anything. It lacks so much detail and looks, well, pixelated. Any strictly 2D games should be post-16-bit, so to speak, to appeal to me... unless it's like the 2D Metroids or Zeldas.
So basically everything should look like Guilty Gear quality?
edgecrusher said:
Yeah I agree.
Its just like with 3D.....why would I want someone to make a new AAA game with PS1-level graphics, instead of something at least around Dreamcast-level, with some actual detail and visually detectable emotion?
I view this whole 2d thing the same way. Its awesome making 2d games, but why revert to way outdated graphics to do it when you could do it with a bit more flash?
Technical standpoint doesn't always = eye appealing. I still prefer Conker's Bad Fur Day's graphics towards the Xbox remake, I still prefer Final Fantasy VII's blocky characters and painted backgrounds as opposed to Final Fantasy XII's detailed ones, and I also prefer the graphics of the N64 Banjo's as opposed to the 360's one. I guess this is just a different stroaks different folks dilemma.
Winds of Nostalgia - I think it's time for everyone (including me) who thought that the DS wasn't capable of rendering decent 3D worlds should slap themselves over the head. I'm sorry but Winds of Nostalgia game looks just ridiculous.
Microsoft's Wii to 360 Migration - So first the Wii doesn't matter because it's an "entirely different market" and now that "different market" will stop playing Gamez Party and moved on to Gears of War? That makes sense.
Where is Leo he can explain why this is so awesome better than most.
MM9 forever!!
Awesome post Leo I can see why some people would like the visuals. Perhaps megaman's greatest era was in the 8bit days. Personally if nintendo announced a new zelda that looked like the NES one I would give it a big old WTF tilted head to the side. If however they announced one that had SNES graphics and was on the VC I would explode.
NES graphics are just a step too far back for my liking I never liked them. In the same way I am happy with xbox/ps2 era visuals, I wouldn't be happy with new games that looks like N64/PS1 games. Although I have different standards for portable games.
Technical standpoint doesn't always = eye appealing. I still prefer Conker's Bad Fur Day's graphics towards the Xbox remake, I still prefer Final Fantasy VII's blocky characters and painted backgrounds as opposed to Final Fantasy XII's detailed ones, and I also prefer the graphics of the N64 Banjo's as opposed to the 360's one. I guess this is just a different stroaks different folks dilemma.
Honestly I think you're just weird. I can use the argument of games on the ps2 era vs the PS3 generation because there is a certain level of technical proficiency coupled with an artistic flair. Games like Wind Waker or Okami, or viewtiful joe etc. You could even say you prefer 2-D visuals to 3-d, I can even understand that if you're talking 16 bit and above. But I cannot understand someone preferring 8 bit or early 3-D visuals at all.
To me, those generations were practice runs. To put it in nintendo terms, the NES and the N64 were unpolished practice runs for the SNES and Gamecube visuals.
With two of those consoles I can comfortable go back and play the games, the visuals remain timeless. For the other two consoles, it can be painful going back there. The 8 bit era had a block look and limited colour palette. The early 3-d consoles had aliasing issues, frame rate issues, scale issues, fogging issues etc. etc. etc.
Oh wow, I just checked out the warioland shake video. I wasn't interested before truthfully but that video looks great. The animation is fantastic. Are clear on whether this is Wiiware or retail yet? I want it.
^^^It seems that you still misunderstand what I am saying. I'm not saying that I prefer the graphics just the look and style of certain games. I don't care how clean and nice the textures or edged the pixels are I just like the look of that better. I find Megaman 9 more visually appealing to me this way then say if they would've made Megaman 9 based on 8's graphics, I just prefer the style. Megaman 9 doesn't look "8-Bit" when I see it but it looks "Oldschool". It would be similar to me prefering those oriental paintings on those tan papers instead of teh ink brushed techniques of Devinci *spelling*. In short Megaman 9 just looks more appealing and visually satisfying to me, that is all I'm saying.
^Sweet retail goodness. I think those wind of nostalgia screens are pretty okay-ish. FFCC Ring of Fates pees all over it and I'm more concerned with RIZ-zoAWD the Wizard of Oz game from Wild Arms developers:
Technical standpoint doesn't always = eye appealing. I still prefer Conker's Bad Fur Day's graphics towards the Xbox remake, I still prefer Final Fantasy VII's blocky characters and painted backgrounds as opposed to Final Fantasy XII's detailed ones, and I also prefer the graphics of the N64 Banjo's as opposed to the 360's one. I guess this is just a different stroaks different folks dilemma.
Honestly I think you're just weird. I can use the argument of games on the ps2 era vs the PS3 generation because there is a certain level of technical proficiency coupled with an artistic flair. Games like Wind Waker or Okami, or viewtiful joe etc. You could even say you prefer 2-D visuals to 3-d, I can even understand that if you're talking 16 bit and above. But I cannot understand someone preferring 8 bit or early 3-D visuals at all.
To me, those generations were practice runs. To put it in nintendo terms, the NES and the N64 were unpolished practice runs for the SNES and Gamecube visuals.
With two of those consoles I can comfortable go back and play the games, the visuals remain timeless. For the other two consoles, it can be painful going back there. The 8 bit era had a block look and limited colour palette. The early 3-d consoles had aliasing issues, frame rate issues, scale issues, fogging issues etc. etc. etc.
Agreed. However, 2D games tend to age way better than 3D ones, even if they are on a console as old as the NES. But the thing here is that we are talking about a franchise that peaked (arguably) on that very same 8-bit, blocky system. Even after a shitload of sequels, spin-offs and crappy games, the appeal of those first three games is unparalleled. I could still sit down and play MM2 in its awesome entirety right now, without paying any attention to the blocky look and limited color palette. Anyway, this arguement is better expressed with a phrase that you love above all things:
Well, this sucks. I turned on my three-year-old laptop this morning, and the cpu/case fan is now making a loud grinding/knocking noise; it's usually pretty quiet. I vaccumed out the fan real well which has helped some, but it still doesn't sound good. I've been around computers enough to know that it'll probably die soon.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure if I can replace it. It's out of warranty, and repair centers are so damn expensive that it might be more worthwhile to just buy another laptop. Sadly, I just can't afford a new one right now.
No, you will need to change the sceen to allow for it, plus remember DS games look less pixilated in real life, because you are watching a smaller screen!
Seriously Winds of Nostalgia looks almost as good as Skies of Arcadia.
Any chance of Nintendo releasing an expansion pack that brings up the resolution of DS games like they did with the N64?
I don't think the DS has a resolution problem, it has a pixellation problem and increasing the resolution isn't going to make pixellated textures look better. That said it really can look gorgeous, especially these JRPGs with fixed viewpoints. It's when they zoom the camera in point blank on character faces that things fall apart. There were times in FFCC Ring of Fates, the building interiors which were just gorgeous. I think Phantom Hourglass players can relate, in certain interior rooms, the graphics were just beautiful. Ring of Fates looks like that a lot of the time.
Well, this sucks. I turned on my three-year-old laptop this morning, and the cpu/case fan is now making a loud grinding/knocking noise; it's usually pretty quiet. I vaccumed out the fan real well which has helped some, but it still doesn't sound good. I've been around computers enough to know that it'll probably die soon.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure if I can replace it. It's out of warranty, and repair centers are so damn expensive that it might be more worthwhile to just buy another laptop. Sadly, I just can't afford a new one right now.
In gaming news, Wario Land Shake looks awesome!
Are you sure it's the fan? I had an issue with an occasionally loud power source (a couple whacks usually shut it up ).
On the topic of 8-bit, I think the PS1/N64 comparisons are a bit unfair, in the difference in visual design in a 3D space versus 2D. The object design is inherent to the game itself in 3D, but blockiness in 2D doesn't really affect things other than visually at all.
The point about 8-bit as I see it is that I'm usually for minimalist design. I like things clean and simple, so good use of limited colours can give a very nice look. I know I much prefer the NES version of Super Mario Bros. visually to the Super Mario All-stars version on the SNES.
Oh, and since it's a new NES game, maybe it'll be sold as one and only be 500 points instead of 800+ if they made it a SNES or WiiWare title.
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Tell me to get back to rewriting this site so it's not horrible on mobile
Yeah I agree.
Its just like with 3D.....why would I want someone to make a new AAA game with PS1-level graphics, instead of something at least around Dreamcast-level, with some actual detail and visually detectable emotion?
I view this whole 2d thing the same way. Its awesome making 2d games, but why revert to way outdated graphics to do it when you could do it with a bit more flash?
I agree whole heartedly.
It's becoming very evident that this game is being designed and animated by an animation company. Wario's animation's and sprite look stellar. Though it will be quite sometime until systems can handle such animation under non-context real-time settings with such highly imported quality files (the PS3 and 360 can't even do it).
So...who here thinks that this game has a chance of selling?
So basically everything should look like Guilty Gear quality?
Technical standpoint doesn't always = eye appealing. I still prefer Conker's Bad Fur Day's graphics towards the Xbox remake, I still prefer Final Fantasy VII's blocky characters and painted backgrounds as opposed to Final Fantasy XII's detailed ones, and I also prefer the graphics of the N64 Banjo's as opposed to the 360's one. I guess this is just a different stroaks different folks dilemma.
One of the site's forefathers.
Winds of Nostalgia - I think it's time for everyone (including me) who thought that the DS wasn't capable of rendering decent 3D worlds should slap themselves over the head. I'm sorry but Winds of Nostalgia game looks just ridiculous.
Microsoft's Wii to 360 Migration - So first the Wii doesn't matter because it's an "entirely different market" and now that "different market" will stop playing Gamez Party and moved on to Gears of War? That makes sense.
One of the site's forefathers.
Awesome post Leo I can see why some people would like the visuals. Perhaps megaman's greatest era was in the 8bit days. Personally if nintendo announced a new zelda that looked like the NES one I would give it a big old WTF tilted head to the side. If however they announced one that had SNES graphics and was on the VC I would explode.
NES graphics are just a step too far back for my liking I never liked them. In the same way I am happy with xbox/ps2 era visuals, I wouldn't be happy with new games that looks like N64/PS1 games. Although I have different standards for portable games.
Honestly I think you're just weird. I can use the argument of games on the ps2 era vs the PS3 generation because there is a certain level of technical proficiency coupled with an artistic flair. Games like Wind Waker or Okami, or viewtiful joe etc. You could even say you prefer 2-D visuals to 3-d, I can even understand that if you're talking 16 bit and above. But I cannot understand someone preferring 8 bit or early 3-D visuals at all.
To me, those generations were practice runs. To put it in nintendo terms, the NES and the N64 were unpolished practice runs for the SNES and Gamecube visuals.
With two of those consoles I can comfortable go back and play the games, the visuals remain timeless. For the other two consoles, it can be painful going back there. The 8 bit era had a block look and limited colour palette. The early 3-d consoles had aliasing issues, frame rate issues, scale issues, fogging issues etc. etc. etc.
Oh wow, I just checked out the warioland shake video. I wasn't interested before truthfully but that video looks great. The animation is fantastic. Are clear on whether this is Wiiware or retail yet? I want it.
^^^It seems that you still misunderstand what I am saying. I'm not saying that I prefer the graphics just the look and style of certain games. I don't care how clean and nice the textures or edged the pixels are I just like the look of that better. I find Megaman 9 more visually appealing to me this way then say if they would've made Megaman 9 based on 8's graphics, I just prefer the style. Megaman 9 doesn't look "8-Bit" when I see it but it looks "Oldschool". It would be similar to me prefering those oriental paintings on those tan papers instead of teh ink brushed techniques of Devinci *spelling*. In short Megaman 9 just looks more appealing and visually satisfying to me, that is all I'm saying.
EDIT - Warioland Wii is confirmed for retail.
One of the site's forefathers.
^Sweet retail goodness. I think those wind of nostalgia screens are pretty okay-ish. FFCC Ring of Fates pees all over it and I'm more concerned with RIZ-zoAWD the Wizard of Oz game from Wild Arms developers:
Agreed. However, 2D games tend to age way better than 3D ones, even if they are on a console as old as the NES. But the thing here is that we are talking about a franchise that peaked (arguably) on that very same 8-bit, blocky system. Even after a shitload of sequels, spin-offs and crappy games, the appeal of those first three games is unparalleled. I could still sit down and play MM2 in its awesome entirety right now, without paying any attention to the blocky look and limited color palette. Anyway, this arguement is better expressed with a phrase that you love above all things:
To each their own.
Sumofabitch.
Well, this sucks. I turned on my three-year-old laptop this morning, and the cpu/case fan is now making a loud grinding/knocking noise; it's usually pretty quiet. I vaccumed out the fan real well which has helped some, but it still doesn't sound good. I've been around computers enough to know that it'll probably die soon.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure if I can replace it. It's out of warranty, and repair centers are so damn expensive that it might be more worthwhile to just buy another laptop. Sadly, I just can't afford a new one right now.
In gaming news, Wario Land Shake looks awesome!
Seriously Winds of Nostalgia looks almost as good as Skies of Arcadia.
Any chance of Nintendo releasing an expansion pack that brings up the resolution of DS games like they did with the N64?
One of the site's forefathers.
No, you will need to change the sceen to allow for it, plus remember DS games look less pixilated in real life, because you are watching a smaller screen!
I don't think the DS has a resolution problem, it has a pixellation problem and increasing the resolution isn't going to make pixellated textures look better. That said it really can look gorgeous, especially these JRPGs with fixed viewpoints. It's when they zoom the camera in point blank on character faces that things fall apart. There were times in FFCC Ring of Fates, the building interiors which were just gorgeous. I think Phantom Hourglass players can relate, in certain interior rooms, the graphics were just beautiful. Ring of Fates looks like that a lot of the time.
Where is rragnaar hiding! Where is my angry smiley?! I read what you said at gamespot rragnaarr! I read it.
Are you sure it's the fan? I had an issue with an occasionally loud power source (a couple whacks usually shut it up
).
On the topic of 8-bit, I think the PS1/N64 comparisons are a bit unfair, in the difference in visual design in a 3D space versus 2D. The object design is inherent to the game itself in 3D, but blockiness in 2D doesn't really affect things other than visually at all.
The point about 8-bit as I see it is that I'm usually for minimalist design. I like things clean and simple, so good use of limited colours can give a very nice look. I know I much prefer the NES version of Super Mario Bros. visually to the Super Mario All-stars version on the SNES.
Oh, and since it's a new NES game, maybe it'll be sold as one and only be 500 points instead of 800+ if they made it a SNES or WiiWare title.
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Tell me to get back to rewriting this site so it's not horrible on mobileWow Wario looks great. Wii should just be an all 2D system from now on. Give me Zelda, Mario and Metroid 2D now!!
BTW MGS4 was updated with new emotion camo to download in the extras section and MGO got two new modes of play.