Forum > Gaming Discussion > Winter: Another canned Mature Wii title
Winter: Another canned Mature Wii title
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Wed, 21 Jan 2009 17:29:07
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Winter Picture

Winter Picture

Winter Picture

Winter Picture

Winter Screenshot

Winter Picture

Winter Screenshot

http://uk.wii.ign.com/articles/946/946492p1.html

About two years ago, development studio n-Space (Call of Duty DS, Geist) showed us its then-in-development Wii-exclusive survival –horror game, Winter. The title, which seemed rooted in efforts like Silent Hill, stood out at the time for a couple reasons. First, it was a Wii project that dealt with a subject matter typically deemed mature by videogame standards: a dark storyline that revolved around an isolated heroine in the middle of a mysterious snowstorm, spooky backdrops and gruesome characters and, of course, violence. And second, it looked good, pushing Wii from a technical standpoint when so many third-parties treated the system with less respect than they did GameCube. Even today, it looks better than a lot of Wii games – impressive for a concept created so quickly by such a small team.

But for so many reasons that the developer talks about below, Winter was not to be -- not due to any major shortcomings on the game's part, but rather the restrictions imposed upon the Wii market by third-party publishers simply unwilling to take a gamble on a more traditional project. Today, IGN presents to you the first look at the in-limbo game complete with details about its origins and development from n-Space president Dan O'Leary and studio creative director Ted Newman, first-ever art, screenshots and direct-feed gameplay footage.

VIDEO AT LINK ABOVE

More pics coming. Sad

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Winter Screenshot

Done. Looks okay, not exactly commercial, about as interesting as Cursed Mountain. It's just sad that there are proper game concepts that can't get funded on Wii.

Edited: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 17:36:48

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Wed, 21 Jan 2009 17:56:39
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Oh noes.

IGN: Tell us what happened. Why didn't this game find a publisher? What was the general reaction?

Dan: We pitched Winter tirelessly for months. The response was universally positive. Every single PD department was very excited about it and confident about moving forward. The look, the story, the overall tone and genre, the gameplay mechanics -- it all came together to create something very compelling for the Wii, something that got gamers excited.

winter-20090120040203159-000.jpg
A word of advice: don't go down there.

With each presentation would come a wave of enthusiastic follow-ups from the publisher. There was so much clamor for the title it was, frankly, kind of overwhelming. We left GDC that year feeling very confident about placing the title quickly and on our terms.

Unfortunately, that wasn't to be. In almost every case we got hung up with the sales and marketing groups. They simply could not get behind a survival horror title on the Wii. In spite of great sales for Resident Evil 4 and the Umbrella Chronicles, these groups were unable to support the projections required to create a viable P&L for the title. The idea of an "adult" game on what they perceived to be a "kids" console was simply too big a leap for them, regardless of the enthusiastic support of the PD department and the Wii's total domination in the marketplace.

IGN: Aren't publishers creating a Catch 22 situation with their refusal to release darker content on Wii? It'll never sell if they don't help create and sustain an audience for it.

Dan: Sure, but I think that's just one symptom of a larger problem. Publishers are missing a lot of opportunities on the Wii. They can't apply their standard approaches to this platform. Risk analysis and sales projection techniques developed over the past 20-plus years of console development no longer apply, which makes folks very uneasy. They don't want to stick their necks out with a sales projection when they aren't able to cite comparable products. Pitching anything that isn't a kid's game for the Wii is an uphill battle.

winter-20090120040205502-000.jpg
Enemies wandering in the snow won't just disappear when you go inside.

Publishers still say to us on a regular basis, "we're still trying to figure out the Wii." It's been over two years since the launch and over three since n-Space first put our hands on prototype controllers. It's kind of ironic really -- you've got this console built on innovation, a console written off by many from day one, that now totally dominates the market, and yet many publishers still hesitate to follow suit with innovative games in all genres.  

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Wed, 21 Jan 2009 18:41:41
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SteelAttack said:

Ravenprose said:

gamingeek said:

Unfortunately, that wasn't to be. In almost every case we got hung up with the sales and marketing groups. They simply could not get behind a survival horror title on the Wii. In spite of great sales for Resident Evil 4 and the Umbrella Chronicles, these groups were unable to support the projections required to create a viable P&L for the title. The idea of an "adult" game on what they perceived to be a "kids" console was simply too big a leap for them, regardless of the enthusiastic support of the PD department and the Wii's total domination in the marketplace.

Crap like this makes me really hate this gen.

FUCK. FUCKING ASSES.

To be honest Winter doesn't look very good and N-Space don't exactly have a great track record, so if those were the reasons for not making this game, I'm fine with it. I would even have been a marketing guy saying no. But if the reason is: Teh Wii can't handle mature games, only kiddie casual games get greenlighted, than that is total BS. The big publishers aren't creating either new or established IPs of proper, big budget core games. So you have this situation where smaller devs are looking to plug these gaps and they can't even get funding. Wii has this catalogue of games because in the board room, suits are deciding that this is all they will put out.

Imagine IF the system had been supported with proper games from the get go from 3rd parties? In year one, in year two and coming up to right now? Instead it feels like everyone has just thrown their hands in the air as if saying WTF? When I look at the Monster Hunter 3 trailer, its just a big old fucking wake up call, huge environments, massive on screen characters, great art, a game that has been development for years. Just the approach you need when making a "proper" game. 3rd party devs mainly suck on the system when it comes to commitment.

We're just lucky that there are quirky, inventive titles out there of a sufficient quality.


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Wed, 21 Jan 2009 19:48:28
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The thing is, if you took the exact same game and presented it at a publisher sayng it was fom CapCom or some shit, the game would have been published. Even if it looked like ass.
I can stomach dated visuals or w/e, but I can't grasp the notion of a console that gets labeled regarding the type of software that can or cannot be offered in it.
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Thu, 22 Jan 2009 00:30:03
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I want to play "EMT woman vs the wolf" the game.

It does look rather crappy but its the kind of crappy I like. Sad to hear they couldnt get this published.

660896.png
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Thu, 22 Jan 2009 03:28:35
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Is that wolf raping her? I think we now know why it isn't getting published.

    Children, our lives have been gongs striking; clamour and boasting; cries of despair; blows on the nape of the neck in gardens.

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Thu, 22 Jan 2009 14:06:15
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SteelAttack said:
The thing is, if you took the exact same game and presented it at a publisher sayng it was fom CapCom or some shit, the game would have been published. Even if it looked like ass.
I can stomach dated visuals or w/e, but I can't grasp the notion of a console that gets labeled regarding the type of software that can or cannot be offered in it.

That's true, but if you have a track record in a genre you would likely get more of a leash when it comes to making something like this. If Platinum games were to present it, it would probably have been made. Can you imagine N-Space showing people Madworld and expecting to get a publisher?

Dvader said:

I want to play "EMT woman vs the wolf" the game.

It does look rather crappy but its the kind of crappy I like. Sad to hear they couldnt get this published.

It does, like a bad looking PS2 game, it has little personality or punch to it. All of what you see though is 6 weeks work for that video. If you read the article they built all that in 3 weeks and then tarted it up for another 3 weeks.  And this was 2 years ago. If the game had gone into development it would likely have looked closer to this. Assuming it shrouded most of the environments in darkness. The lighting in that video vs the wolf looked pretty good in shaping the models.

Winter Screenshot

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Thu, 22 Jan 2009 15:41:35
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gamingeek said:

SteelAttack said:
The thing is, if you took the exact same game and presented it at a publisher sayng it was fom CapCom or some shit, the game would have been published. Even if it looked like ass.
I can stomach dated visuals or w/e, but I can't grasp the notion of a console that gets labeled regarding the type of software that can or cannot be offered in it.

That's true, but if you have a track record in a genre you would likely get more of a leash when it comes to making something like this. If Platinum games were to present it, it would probably have been made. Can you imagine N-Space showing people Madworld and expecting to get a publisher?

Dvader said:

I want to play "EMT woman vs the wolf" the game.

It does look rather crappy but its the kind of crappy I like. Sad to hear they couldnt get this published.

It does, like a bad looking PS2 game, it has little personality or punch to it. All of what you see though is 6 weeks work for that video. If you read the article they built all that in 3 weeks and then tarted it up for another 3 weeks.  And this was 2 years ago. If the game had gone into development it would likely have looked closer to this. Assuming it shrouded most of the environments in darkness. The lighting in that video vs the wolf looked pretty good in shaping the models.

Winter Screenshot

Definitely. Madworld would have been left forgotten. And shit, what's that last screen? What game is it from? It looks great.

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Thu, 22 Jan 2009 20:03:35
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Same game, just a better render. It looks good, but if you think about say Ashley's face in RE4 on gamecube, it's not something that Wii couldn't do, especially if the game had environments shrouded in darkness.

re4ashley.jpg

Remember that Xbox's normal mapping games got by because of the dark shadows and disguising a lot. Chaos Theory, Doom 3, Chronicles of Riddick.

The pic above has a good face model with nice lighting applied.

You, I know this sounds like some sort of appeasement/betrayel sort of shit. But they could have kept the concept and kiddified it like a Disney movie. Get a good writer in, make it feel like Home Alone, have a kid or group of kids stuck in this snowstorm, comedy atmosphere, missing parents, blowguns, catapults, romance. LOL early teen romance LOL Goonies style. Baddies, bank robberies. You know with a little imagination and willingness, you can come up with something fun and more commercial.

Take inspiration from Bully, the Gummi Bears and Home Alone. You have the ultimate game.

Edited: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 20:28:07

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Fri, 23 Jan 2009 03:41:50
Good face model except for the ears. Seriously.

    Children, our lives have been gongs striking; clamour and boasting; cries of despair; blows on the nape of the neck in gardens.

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Fri, 23 Jan 2009 12:45:58
She's the daughter of Prince Charles.

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Fri, 23 Jan 2009 14:32:42

gamingeek said:
She's the daughter of Prince Charles.

Don Flamenco?

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Tue, 27 Jan 2009 11:47:09

So I just got a reponse out of Capcom Vice President Christian Svensson and he replied to my questions, which was asking about the board room process of greenlighting mature games on the system:

If this were something that wouldn't be picked up and twisted across the net with vitriolic responses, I would respond to this thread with a more open answer. Because some Wii fans and fan sites aren't likely to leave things be, I'm afraid I can't provide much color on this but to say, yes, that catch 22 is a bitch.


Understand that publishers will point to retailers not asking for/supporting that content in significant volumes (unless there's a big brand like RE attached). And retailers will in turn point to consumers not demanding/supporting that content (again, without a big brand or Nintendo attached) and then consumers come back to publishers screaming "why isn't that content being created".


So there's no easy answer here.

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Tue, 27 Jan 2009 16:31:04
Man, that sucks.
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Sat, 28 Mar 2009 12:40:49

Matt C IGN:

On Wednesday, I got a text from Dan O'Leary, president of development studio n-Space, probably best known for the first-person shooter Geist for GameCube and, more recently, Winter. You might remember the latter as an in-development survival-horror game for Wii, as I ran a piece on the title a short while ago complete with first video. Since then, fans have campaigned for Winter, going so far as to create and populate a petition in support of the project. O'Leary said he was in town with creative director Ted Newman and wanted to show me what they had dubbed "Winter 2.0," an improved version of the original demo. Since I last saw the game, n-Space assembled a small team and spent about two weeks updating and adding polish to it. Some notable changes. It now uses Wii MotionPlus for more accurate character attacks and object-based interactions. The 3D engine has seen some optimizations. Most obvious, the textures have all been up-rezzed and the muddy look on up-close exteriors is removed. n-Space has added a host of graphic effects, like more realistic falling snow, and completely overhauled the flashlight so that it beams forward a per-pixel light that looks fantastic as it illuminates darkened hallways. I asked O'Leary why he was in San Francisco with Winter 2.0 and he explained that a few publishers have showed some interest in it, which is a good sign. With any luck, maybe the project will find its way to retail yet.

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Sat, 28 Mar 2009 13:45:34
It's pretty bad when DS graphics look as good as Wii graphics now.

Also,
gamingeek said:

Winter Screenshot


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Sat, 28 Mar 2009 18:23:15

Aint nothing wrong with that LOL

He's shielding her from the cold.

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Sun, 29 Mar 2009 02:18:16
And warming her up X-Con style!

Zap!

    Children, our lives have been gongs striking; clamour and boasting; cries of despair; blows on the nape of the neck in gardens.

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Sun, 29 Mar 2009 12:57:05
X con?

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Mon, 30 Mar 2009 04:29:25
There's one.
The one I was thinking of microwaved its victims instead. Nyaa

    Children, our lives have been gongs striking; clamour and boasting; cries of despair; blows on the nape of the neck in gardens.

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